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Switching over to the NA scoring system
Created 14th March 2013 @ 16:41
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To be honest, I don’t understand the overall positive feedback. One map per week means that officials often get very unexciting because mostly the map is decided well before you hit the 60 minute mark and then the official is over. 60 minutes, winlimit 5 actually encourages slow play in my opinion, seeing as you have a lot of time to let your roamer bomb repeatedly or suicide a scout for offclassing purposes (sniper, spy, heavy, whatever works). Plus you can hold forever if you feel like it although I agree that nobody would want to turtle for 20 minutes.
A positive aspect is the halftime, allowing you to discuss your mistakes and what you’re trying next. We could however introduce a “time-out”, a 2 minute pause which can be taken once per map/official by either team at any time. It was very well accepted in the various ESL EPS competitions. Combined with timelimit 30 and winlimit 5 this could generate really exciting, aggressive two map matches that don’t lack a tactical component.
Last edited by feeling,
This is aimed at no one particularly in this thread, it’s more something I’ve noticed time and time again when this sort of discussion comes up…
THERE IS A ROUND TIMER. TEAMS CANT TURTLE FOR LONGER THAN THE ROUND TIMER. IT’S NOT HARD. Teams only turtle toward the end of a game because the game time is less than the round time.
Last edited by kaidus,
I’m pretty sure NA people play their scrims and pugs with timelimit 30, so scheduling wouldn’t be an issue
Quoted from feeling
60 minutes, winlimit 5 actually encourages slow play in my opinion
Well your opinion is wrong. There’s 5 and a half years worth of evidence in the NA scene to prove otherwise.
I’m all for this, but like the saying goes here in my country, you can’t “do a step bigger than your leg”, this means, don’t get ahead of yourself…
A unified ruleset? Great, one of the best things that can happen to comp scene. (not sure if the OZ scene uses NA ruleset) but it would be great, even better would be like to have one “FIFA” for TF2 comp, like one organization that would dictate and organize the global ruleset for tf2, this would be the utopic dream for an esport.
Changing overnight with no tools or preparation? Nope. Please don’t even think about doing this before you have a server plugin or a user client ready for release that automatically logs the matches and uploads the results. An automated plugin (something like tftrue with even more options) would be the ideal, that way it could also work for pcw’s.
I have been pushing towards the unified ruleset since I first started comp, but for that to happen you need to have the same tools or at least tools at the same level as the americans do, I can’t even see it happen without an automated plugin, it would be total chaos.
My 2cents, keep it like it is until you have the site/api rebuilt and working well, and an automated plugin for the matches.
Quoted from xzr
Have you guys actually ever seen a yank match?
“Turtle until our roamer solly gets lucky and picks the enemy medic, push”
sounds like eu to me
Quoted from Skyride
[…]
Well your opinion is wrong. There’s 5 and a half years worth of evidence in the NA scene to prove otherwise.
I elaborated (you cut that part for whatever reason: “seeing as you have a lot of time to let your roamer bomb repeatedly or suicide a scout for offclassing purposes”) and so should you. Plus it’s pretty iffy to call an opinion wrong. I watch a lot of NA TF2, especially this season. Just look at bp’s matches.
Last edited by feeling,
Quoted from Admirable
Yeah overtime/golden caps are what djc was talking about.
I couldn’t honestly tell you how many matches a season last longer than 30 minutes or hit the 60 minute mark.
A lot go over 30, but generally not by very much. Games between equal teams generally go for like 40 (not including half time). Hitting the 60 minute mark isn’t unheard of but generally not a factor. I’ve seen a couple overtimes, but can’t recall any since they got rid of yukon (lolfuckyukon).
To expand on why I am opposed to the team colour switch:
– It’s harder for viewers to follow if they don’t watch right the way through
– Screws up casting assets (scoreboard, overlay, interstitial graphics, team skins)
– People who cry about map imbalances must be agitated further (get good?)
Quoted from ilike2spin
How do teams do pcws over in America? Would we just do 1 map at 20 and 1 map at 21?
play an hour of pcws -> play match -> leave
Quoted from atmo
– Screws up casting assets (scoreboard, overlay, interstitial graphics, team skins)
the scoreboard (for vtv anyway) has a button to switch team colours, and nothing else is fixed anyway to a certain team colour (unless tftv is doing something im forgetting)
Playing the clock is a skill, and a skill that teams should learn to use. From watching games, you notice so many teams simply do not know how to play the clock. They are 3 rounds down, with 5 minutes remaining, and they still believe that they have time to wait outside the enemy’s base and build uber. At that point in the game, the losing team needs to be playing high risk TF2, while the defending team can either attempt to turtle up and hold (which is risky on its own as you give away free ground), they can try to slow the game down (smart play), or they can play as normal (they are 3 rounds up, so also smart as it means they have been outplaying their opponent).
If you think the American system stops say, CP 2 – 3 standoffs from happening, then you’re wrong. If the winning team is holding CP3, it should be their position to push, but if they decide not to do so, it means the team with the disadvantage has to make the push. They either decide to push when the game balance is against them, and risk losing another round, or they concede their currently scoreline, and wait it out for a round stalemate or second half. The reason why you don’t see as many stalemates in US tf2, is not because of the rules, but because of their mentality. If they have an advantage, they push it, meaning the team holding CP3, push their advantage of having more capture points to fall back on if something goes wrong.
It’s also bad for spectators. Scoreline first half is 3-1. Then they swap over, score second half is 2-3 and spectators are confused as to why team A are celebrating, why the map is over etc… The clock is a very simple system which boils down to the principle: Whoever can cap the most in this amount of time, wins the game. How teams go about this, is their own problem, but you don’t need to change the system to
I do believe that map times should be shortened to either 20 or 25 minutes each. This is to try and get TF2 matches into 1 hour slots, instead of 1 hour 15 or 1 hour 30 time slots. It might also mean smaller scorelines which results in closer games, which means less stalemates. It’s rare that a team with a one round lead will turtle up than a team with a three round lead. Shorter game times mean less chance of those ‘larger leads’.
Last edited by AcidReniX,
Oh and if you’re talking about a unified ruleset, how comes EU hasn’t allowed the full US unlock list? :P
If you’re just going to copy them, might as well just go the full way, otherwise don’t talk about the positives of unifying the ruleset, because they are still completely different.
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