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Quoted from SmitZ

[…]
Wow, div3. Prestigious!

This thread is not about how much you dislike highlander, that’s my point. By all means you can complain that it doesn’t look like 6v6 will be supported. I would totally agree with you on this, but spewing out insults to highlander players just makes you look like a prick.

I love that you’re calling me out on being elitist when you called me a “div5 scrub” and repeatedly mock highlander. You really are a hypocrite.

here are some of your quotes:
Quoted from SmitZ

[…]

Stop acting like an internet tough guy. You play div4 6v6, that hardly gives you the right to act as you are.

Quoted from SmitZ

So please take your utterly stupid opinions elsewhere you idiotic piece of shit.

and then you come in and call me a hypocrite, lol
and I’m not elitist, but you started the div thing, might as well throw shit at you as well? sort your life out

Quoted from ondkaja

[…]

The suggestion of placing sneaky sentries was intentionally stupid to emphasise the fact that you should hold positions instead of playing like a retard. If you didn’t get the message perhaps you shouldn’t criticise me of not being able to read.

Yes, teams will eventually break down any defence, but the fact that well-defended maps can take 15 minutes to finish is enough for a wrangler ban in my opinion, because on maps where it is easy to defend (such as upward), you must not make any screwups during the push, even if the enemy team has a bad position, or has a lot of players down.

[…]

A lesson of “holding properly”, as demonstrated by your team: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUypEwpxuCc

:D

I think you’ll find that the 15 minute map times aren’t so purely because of the wrangler. They’re like that because one team is better than the other. You’re massively overstating the wrangler’s power.

And as for the video; it has nothing to do with the wrangler. That’s simply a personal attack on one of my team’s players that is not at all relevant to the discussion. More importantly it has nothing to do with me.

Quoted from rytis

I’m not elitist

Haha! Good one.

Quoted from Sideshow

I’m saying that we didn’t have a clue before we had the experience, and it doesn’t make sense to then hand back the decision making into the hands of those with the least experience.

Ah you suggest that none of us will ever use this system!

Many people will use this system. Including, but not limited to, pub players that have no idea what impact certain weapons have, yes. They aren’t the only ones though.

“The top of highlander” is also silly. There are plenty of pub players that are at an equal or perhaps higher skill level (or IQ value which is what matters more actually) – but they may not have the time to actually play HL as the folks here on ETF2L do (or other reasons).

Quoted from SmitZ

[…]

I think the point is that the number of pub players using the system will greatly outnumber the amount of “top highlander players.”

Yep. Means nothing though.

Rofl you think the competitive scene will make ANY dent in these stats?

And in all my time playing 6v6, I’m really struggling to think of more than 5 people who fit your anti-stereotype of lower div players knowing more about the game than top level players. I imagine it’s the same for highlander.

Blablablabla I wanted to read but I skimread.

It looks like SmitZ/sideshow has the better side of the argument here. Comp players know more about what is OP than a pubber does. Pyro is OP in pubs because people don’t understand melee distance. Pyro gets shit on by every other class in comp because people realise that fire can only reach so far. <- just one example of a contrast between pub thoughts and comp thoughts.

The difference is this is more of a valve lobby thing and it is a better idea to give the choice to the players even if it means certain things get banned now and again.

I imagine things will turn out as they are atm regarding unlocks simply because as time goes on, it seems right. Wrangler arguments are always going to happen and that weapon needs more of a tweak than a ban to make it less of an upgrade but it is also a weapon in comp that promotes using actual team play than just being able to click at the right time.

Also as its a lobby system, it isn't a LEAGUE. So ETF2L and UGC and Wireplay will be around for Highlander and a valve lobby isn't going to influence it too much. And what will happen is the transition of valve lobby players would go to ugc/etf2l, see the whitelist think, hey you know, with a team and comms this actually isn't an OP weapon, and they will stop getting banned in the valve lobbies.

Please stop the qq

Shit. Fuck admin powers.

Edited sideshow’s post instead of quoting.. :(

Just goes to confirm my stupidity I suppose

Attempt #2:

Quoted from Sideshow

Rofl you think the competitive scene will make ANY dent in these stats?

No, that’s not what I said (or maybe I did say it, I honestly don’t know sometimes.. it’s not what I meant anyway).

Quoted from Sideshow

And in all my time playing 6v6, I’m really struggling to think of more than 5 people who fit your anti-stereotype of lower div players knowing more about the game than top level players. I imagine it’s the same for highlander.

I’m willing to bet that more than half of pub players that don’t play comp, don’t play comp for good reasons, reasons that aren’t necessarily skill-related. Besides, TF2 isn’t a difficult game with a dota-like learning curve. Anyone can get relatively far (even I managed to make it as far as div3, just saying).

I still get stomped in pubs. Bad example perhaps but the point stands.

None of that is relevant though.

Quoted from rytis

[…]
you dont even know me, calling me elitist is pretty dumb lol

So is telling me to “sort my life out.” Wow, yet again you fail to actually argue back effectively.

Quoted from Andee

[…]

I second this. I do still enjoy playing pubs from time to time but, especially on larger servers, you are basically playing a lottery. Most players have no clue what to do. Especially on capture point maps. Competitive formats might learn these players more
about the strategic depths of TF2 and make pubbing a bit more fun for veteran competitive players.

I don’t really think this is true. It will essentially be a more popular TF2lobby. And that site can already be pretty frustrating, for example when you have a medic with 5 lobbies who doesn’t really know the healing order for his teammates and lets everyone die during ubers, etc etc. This new system won’t be any different. But I guess you’re right in a way, it’s still good that it’s going to be implemented, I just think it’s “too little too late” as I said earlier.