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How to punish the droppers?
Created 25th October 2010 @ 13:53
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Quoted from herpderp
….4 weeks….
Both of those mean potentially punishing 5 people for the actions of 1.
Au contraire mon amie, if one person leaves they cant join a team for 4 weeks but the rest of the team can easily recruit a replacement.
This idea encourages stability as teams will have to recruit to play the season if someone leaves, rather than just scrapping the team and joining some mates or whatever.
Last edited by Monkeh,
It’s good in theory, but it’s already difficult to find and recruit players at a div 2+ level, and if half of those are on 4 week probation periods then that might make more teams drop, due to a lack of possible recruits.
Quoted from Andee
I am against any kind of punishment in any form. You need to stimulate forming new teams, not punish them if they fail to exist. It might be annoying that a clan folds, but if you want to keep an open league, you have to deal with drops. Imo that comes with the package.
This.
Rewarding stability is only nice for the stable teams and won’t help potential folding teams at all. Not getting a reward is no reason not to drop. Teams don’t really lose anything and obviously they don’t drop for nothing. The only way to have less drops is if teams start being more realistic in their expectation of their skill, results and activity.
edit: Now I think about it, prohibiting everyone in this thread who hasnt scheduled their week 2 game yet from posting would also work.
You know I like that idea Tikcus, but it wont stop those players in a team that loses it’s first match of the proper season just RQ’ing and joining another, leaving that team in the shits and having to fold.
At least with a ‘cooling off’ period enforced between team changes those same players might just think twice before jumping ship.
Ingame rewards aren’t a solution. ESL offers medals and three weeks into the league there was a total of three teams left in our division.
Maybe the question should not be “How to punish the teams that drop” but “How to prevent teams that will drop from joining.” RL issues, other commitments, lack of interest, people likely to ragequit at the first loss, the fact that you all hate each other, it all usually doesn’t happen overnight. If you fold within the first week of the season then you’ve likely seen it coming when you signed up. So why sign up in the first place? Because you hope that you somehow magically make it through the season? Or is it because you just don’t care? I’ve heard “Yeah, we’re probably gonna fold anyway” often enough.
The problem is, however, that it’s the team’s own responsibility not to enter the league in this case and that’s apparently too much to expect on the internet.
Last edited by hans,
I don’t know if someone already said it but players who RQ after 1 match have a hard time to find a new team since their old team will kinda flame them in their recrutment post :P so its like a natural punishment for teamhopping RQ’ing.
Quoted from Monkeh
At least with a ‘cooling off’ period enforced between team changes those same players might just think twice before jumping ship.
The problem with this “cooling off” period is that it punishes an entire team for the actions of possibly one or two people. If two people leave a team early in the season for whatever reason and they can not replace these people, should the other four be punished for something that they could have never prevented?
I like Tikcus’s suggestion, but the “force someone to wait XX weeks before they can join a team after leaving” and all these other suggestions will end up punishing people for something they could not have prevented. It looks good on paper, but there’s too many reasons why teams fold/drop from a season to punish them for it. Sure some situations could possibly warrant a punishment, but doesn’t mean all situations do.
Quoted from hans
Maybe the question should not be “How to punish the teams that drop” but “How to prevent teams that will drop from joining.”
Come on mate, preventing finnish teams from joining etf2l seems a bit racist.
Quoted from herpderp
The problem with this “cooling off” period is that it punishes an entire team for the actions of possibly one or two people. If two people leave a team early in the season for whatever reason and they can not replace these people, should the other four be punished for something that they could have never prevented?
But….but…how does the fact that someone, (let’s say lolage for fun!), leaves DAKKA in a fit of ragey pique and get’s himself a 4 week ban on joining a team. You go out and recruit a new demo, (as you would have done anyway!), and carry on. The rest of your team isn’t punished in any way at all! If you couldn’t replace him, (and I mean seriously, how would that even be possible! It’s hard to replace a Lollllagggggeeeeee :) ), then you’d have to fold anyway! Not sure I get what you’re driving at Eledorian.
Granted you need to recruit someone and that may be a bit more tricky with some cooling off periods being handed out, but I’m sure you’d manage to find someone who hadn’t recently left a team.
ban Hat and Nitro.
=]
Quoted from Monkeh
[…]
stuff
You still haven’t addressed how it would work on a higher level. It isn’t easy to replace someone when there’s only 2-3 potential candidates at most.
Quoted from Monkeh
You know I like that idea Tikcus, but it wont stop those players in a team that loses it’s first match of the proper season just RQ’ing and joining another, leaving that team in the shits and having to fold.
At least with a ‘cooling off’ period enforced between team changes those same players might just think twice before jumping ship.
With this in mind, how does this apply for instance Huhy? Left Crack Clan for personal reasons, but Crack Clan doesn’t fold nor did Huhy do anything that even remotely negative to other teams. Yet with your proposal, he would be banned from joining another team for a month.
As I said earlier, the solution isn’t to punish folding, but to reward and promote stability (which can be done by the community as well and not just by us).
Last edited by Buffalo Bill,
Quoted from kuma
[…]
You still haven’t addressed how it would work on a higher level. It isn’t easy to replace someone when there’s only 2-3 potential candidates at most.
One possible solution
semi locked rosters at the top, you can add unsigned players, but a player can’t team hop from 1 team to another mid season. (maybe just this rule for prem/div 1/ div 2).
If a team drops mid season for any reason, they are automatically banned from entering the following season, that would include new teams with > 50% of players made up from a team that dropped
this would promote stability
All teams should have a minimum roster of 8 players
Last edited by Tikcus,
Quoted from kuma
You still haven’t addressed how it would work on a higher level. It isn’t easy to replace someone when there’s only 2-3 potential candidates at most.
Isn’t it always hard to recruit in the top tiers?
Hmmmmmmm, better minds than mine are needed to take this idea forwards maybe, but, using a recent example, would hymzi have left imperial if he couldn’t join another team for 4 weeks? Obviously I have no idea, but the 4 week thing might work quite well as a deterrent to top players leaving their teams in the first place, which is what I’m trying to achieve.
Punishment isn’t workable or fair, but encouragement to form stable teams must be achievable somehow!
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