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Quoted from Tomu

So you can’t play with your friends who are newer to comp simply because you used to play in a higher division?

Mixes, scrims, lobbies, pubs, surely more options. Official leagues with divisions are a different story. If he really only wants to play with friends I don’t see why it has to be in an official league with divisions (remember what I said in my first post?).

Quoted from Tomu

According to you I have sandbagged in UGC all my seasons, (holy shit I played a couple officials at div 1 :OOOOOOOOOO) including this current one, where sure I am playing below my division even though I am off classing because gamesense etc will be better than the newer players. Luckily for Steel I’m on an insignificant class so no petitions for me (I’m deeply hurt by this but then I realised I’m bad anyway) but even if I was on heavy/demoman (Which I’ve played 3 seasons in Steel/Silver when I was actually “good” at tf2) and considered one of the carries on the teams.

I said I don’t wanna know about other players sandbagging/playing in lower divisions as an excuse. I’ve played against you and I know you are not as much of a threat as Joe is, and I’m not saying this trying to offend you. Plus saying that ‘luckily I’m playing on a insignificant class’ just defeats your point. Joe is playing a VERY significant class, especially for steel level. He is giving his already strong team (as referred to them below) such an incredible boost in terms of skill that it really is unfair, impossible to overcome to newcomers and generally frustrating.

Quoted from Tomu

I’ll tell you because clearly the people who made this petition and yourself for complaining about ONE player on a team. This is probably the most insane idea anybody has ever had in the history of TF2 but, what do you do if you focus down the one good player that everybody seems to think is clearly carrying his team through everything and the rest of his team just sit in spawn and compare each others nails?

I doubt new steel players have the capability of focusing down that ‘one good’ player if he the whole (already great) team plays around him like what I’ve seen from OiaV. Every team has his carry, but I feel like overcoming them usually is far easier than it is with Joe. And unlike other teams with carries Joe has a strong team to back him up. This means killing him (and most likely using up a lot of resources to do so) will still put you at a disadvantage. I also dislike OiaV putting him on his roster, if you feel I’m only trying to bash him.

Quoted from Tomu

OiaV works better as a team than most of the Steel teams and I am 90% sure that it’s not just down to Joe. Might be due to the fact they scrim teams better than them to improve? But that’s probably a stupid idea as well, you should ALWAYS scrim teams worse than you because then at least you stop your feelings getting hurt when you do lose. :)

From what I heard OiaV is already a strong team like you say, so I guess this means there would be a fair skill gap between them and the other steel teams even if they didn’t have Joe? That makes it even more unfair and defeats your point seeing as they also have a prem gamesense heavy.
This is exactly why people don’t complain about most other sandbaggers, simply because they are not being supported by one of strongest team in the first place. (speaking only of what I’ve seen)

Plus, you have NOT even touched on the main point of my whole argument. Wether it be sandbagging or simply being incredibly good, creating such a huge skill gap in a division and knowing about it is against the principles of an official league and only hurts those who are new to the scene. And Joe has had enough scrims to realise he is far above steel, even on heavy.

– Doktor

Me saying “luckily insignificant class blabla” is sarcasm btw.

I’ve heard that heavies are quite easy to shoot from afar with a sniper rifle. Probably just a rumour.

Also they’re a strong team because they’re probably more keen than most steel teams so they’ve improved faster than the rest making them seem super scary to the ones that don’t practice as much or have people with no control over their mouse.

The skillgap is there because UGC Steel generally covers Div 6 – Bottom Div 4. Bottom div 4 are the keen teams and theres only a few of those usually each season, Div 5 is the majority at the end of the season, and div 6 are the ones that performed really badly. Any lower than that you surely wouldn’t enter into Steel when theres a Iron division, specifically for new players to not play some teams who could be good.

Also there is a skillgap because there are only like, 2 european admins now for UGC, with one person managing at least 3 divisions? You surely don’t expect 2 people out of the entire european scene knows everybody and all of their skill levels and how the teams play? If you have a problem, get people to step up and apply to be an admin, if they think they have the ability of course.

Steel is generally no names and old names teaching no names. It has always been this way so why are people suddenly so miffed.

Quoted from droso

I am so gonna play scout in div6 when I’m done with this game and just want some fun.

I knew that such a flamebait reply would come shortly after my post, but I am disappointed to see it from someone like you, droso.

People are still replying on this rather than the Wireplay thread come on people! Map list is important :(

Quoted from Doktor

[…]

I knew that such a flamebait reply would come shortly after my post, but I am disappointed to see it from someone like you, droso.

¯_(ツ)_/¯

In all seriousness though, this thread/petition is quite the overreaction imho.
If this was a league solely intended for brand newcomers, I would agree this would be a dick move, but once you sign up to a competitive league which is exactly what steel is, you can’t complain about some team using a better player.

Quoted from Tomu

I’ve heard that heavies are quite easy to shoot from afar with a sniper rifle. Probably just a rumour.

Can confirm.

Quoted from frixx

[…]

flood u are right I agree with you, but u simply cannot compare medic to a demoman. Medic depends too much on other classes/players performance(checking sticky traps,protection, flank coverage etc.) that u can’t compare it with an assault class such as demoman. I tought you as a medic would understand the difference

Yeah obviously, but the main point I was putting across is that there was no need for you to chip in with something that just made it worse. Imo just leave it as it is between the steel players
This whole thread seems to have just been started unnecessarily thinking people should care enough. Just leave it to the people this has an effect on.