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ETF2L S16 Ruleset Feedback
Created 9th September 2013 @ 20:07
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In all honesty monkeh, arx does have a point, and I think you’re overreacting in your theorycrafting a bit.
If you can dodge scouts, you can dodge flare shots as well (more easily so). Plus pyro remains situational, as running it full time means giving up a class that is way more suited in a lot more situations.
Sure, you may die to a pyro every once in a while, but in the grand scheme of things, you cannot possibly argue that, had that pyro been a scout or a roamer, it would have been impossible for the outcome to be the same.
Meh, it’s fun to discuss/argue stuff :p
Next week, tune in to see me argue for more unlocks to be added :D
Monkeh.
These weapons have been allowed in NA for a long time.
Without a doubt NA has better pyros than EU. Why are the pyros not running around breaking things like you say they are? Because they’re not doing it at any decent competitive level.
Stop over reacting and man up. It is not the pyro nor his unlocks, it is the team that cannot kill a single pyro that over extends in these situations.
T-t-this thread actually influenced something, I feel good, I feel really warm and fuzzy inside :3
About the unlocks it’s about time we are changing our “last century” mentality, the truth is, we need unlocks not only to keep the format non-stagnant but to approach and get closer to the pub community instead distancing ourselves from them. I hope to see new additions every season and hopefully one day keep it unified with the NA whitelist.
I would have hoped for the cloak and dagger, ambassador and the market gardener tho, these are unlocks that add a really different dimension to the game and make it much more exciting both to watch and play. (also pls some demo unlocks).
Things really turned upside down, 1 year ago I was a “div5 shitter” over on the forums advocating for more unlocks while all the prem players wanted full vanilla. Today we can see the comment section where “div5 shitters” (dont take it personally) are throwing a fit over a few pyro weapons and the most experienced prem players (ex: GeaR) are advocating for unlocks.
I’m really happy with the direction the league is taking, the most important part is done, which is prem players acknowledging unlocks dont hurt the game and if anything they add something to it.
About all the people throwing a fit over a couple pyro weapons, think for a moment, pyro is probably the most useless classes in 6v6 atm, it’s a kamikaze class with no other purpose other than serving as a bump to delay the enemy team. These unlocks add a new or better purpose to the class, allowing it to benefit the team in plenty more situations.
Also if you take a look at plenty of online polls or votes, you will see the most played classes or favorite classes played by pubbers are pyro and spy by a large margin (ie: a quick search on google showed this http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.303813-Poll-What-class-do-you-play-in-Team-fortress-2?page=2 ), restricting these 2 classes or making them near useless is a good way to alienate half the pub community from ever getting in 6v6.
If you actually love the competitive scene and are not a egoistical jerk you will agree with these changes and support them because these changes have the potential to make the community grow. Closing ourselves behind our elitist and egoistical views will cause the scene to die significantly faster.
Quoted from Monkeh
Pretty sure axe was banned almost instantly cuz free crits.
Axtinguisher got banned with Vanilla.
Quoted from Forsak3n
CanFo, how could you let this happen?
I’m not making these decisions anymore but I welcome them :D
I, for one, welcome our new perma pyro overlords!
I don’t suppose we’ll get an explanation of the idea behind allowing each weapon and where it came from? Like why allow l’etranger? Why allow Black Box? (and not say Direct hit?)
Quoted from Enef
I don’t suppose we’ll get an explanation of the idea behind allowing each weapon and where it came from? Like why allow l’etranger? Why allow Black Box? (and not say Direct hit?)
Direct hit can be a Straight upgrade as long as you have a very good aim, so it can be considered as Straight upgrade, Black box has 1 less rocket and gives +15 health on Hit, so it makes Roamer job a bit easier and less pressure on Medic
Quoted from Popcorp
[…]
Direct hit can be a Straight upgrade as long as you have a very good aim, so it can be considered as Straight upgrade, Black box has 1 less rocket and gives +15 health on Hit, so it makes Roamer job a bit easier and less pressure on Medic
I don’t think that’s right, at least the DH part. But I was specifically hoping for someone who was behind the decision making, not someone who thinks they know.
Quoted from Monkeh
[…]
Yeah yeah, semantics. I have dodged snipers shooting at me, I have dodged scouts shooting at me. At least I feel like I have some control over the situation. Stand behind my pocket, use some scenery as cover, spam WASD etc, stuff I can do to make it harder for them to kill me. Not true with deg/axe pyro, if he get’s close, I’m dead. (Full stop)
[…]
So 2 flare guns hitting me from across the map is less than a full clip of pistol shots?
[…]
Haven’t you just answered your own question with the opposite answer there?
Not really no. The first one is mentioning that I very much doubt many teams are suddenly going to implement a Pyro into their standard classes (if they did, I’d be looking for a team right away!).
The second one is just trying to flip what you were saying around. You were suggesting that as a medic you would die more often because when you walk around a corner a Pyro is going to burnblastaxe you, but I was simply stating that _if Pyros were used more_ you would probably die even less than you currently do because the pyro would counter the common gunboats soldier threat. You only looked at one side of the story (how you would die to the ‘new pyro’) instead of thinking of the occasions where the ‘new pyro’ would save you. This is a common problem with our community and unlocks, people don’t look at the bigger picture, only what directly affects them.
A pyro axtinguishing you or flaregunning you would be a pretty annoying way to die but it is easily avoided by focusing him if he comes close. He is really only useful at point blank, in which he is easily destriyed by soldiers and scouts.
Quoted from Enef
I don’t suppose we’ll get an explanation of the idea behind allowing each weapon and where it came from? Like why allow l’etranger? Why allow Black Box? (and not say Direct hit?)
I don’t know how the admins come to their decisions, but I guess it’s more on the lines of, “Will this have a chance of breaking the game?” If no… allow it, but at the same time, trying to add unlocks that might actually get used instead of just hundreds of useless ones. I guess the black box is a slightly less controversial choice than the direct hit.
Quoted from ondkaja
A pyro axtinguishing you or flaregunning you would be a pretty annoying way to die but it is easily avoided by focusing him if he comes close. He is really only useful at point blank, in which he is easily destriyed by soldiers and scouts.
People just need to remember, it is a straight up buff to the Pyro… without any doubt… it’s still just a Pyro. I just can’t see them causing more problems than a demoman, scout, soldier or sniper does already… It’s just different and people are scared of another way to die.
It’s all a conspiracy so that Head Admin Permzilla’s scout partner Buttnose can go perma-pyro and kill everything.
I think you guys need to see this less as unlocks balanced in on their own merits and more a step toward acclimatisation to the ESEA ruleset.
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