Forum
Scripts, settings, etc
Created 15th July 2008 @ 02:40
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Right, this is not meant to be a flaming thread or anything. But rather I would like to find out what is, and isnt, allowed in ETF2L.
Yesterday I found myself being somewhat bored and decided to spec a game from the ESL National warmup cup. Speccing for a while i saw some players who seemed to crouch in every jump, not being difficult in any way it sure is cumbersome to do it during every single jump. Being unsure as to what the rules say about so called “crouch jump scripts” i decided to have a look in some of the participating players cfgs. However, reading the etf2l rules i saw that this was indeed allowed. ESL has a rule regarding something called “highjump script”, but i assume that is something completely else.
Anyhow, while having a look in some cfgs I saw a few different aliases/setting which I am unsure whether they are allowed or not. If wanted, i can paste the scripts from the cfgs, but those interested can just as well go download the actual cfgs instead than having me paste what might be considered “cheats”.
Rapid fire sticky (hold a button to fire, detonate stickies midair in close combat)
Hide weapon setting (just a flag to set to 0 to remove weapon.. dont know if this is considered a cheat.. heard someone claiming so a while back.. ).
Various autoreload-scripts(doubt that this is a cheat:P might as well check though)
cl_interp (ok, i still dont understand what this setting does.. people seem to whine about it from time to time.. which values are allowed?)
Some scripts arent forbidden, unfortunatly valve should be the one giving the step by not allowing scripts on the clients, so the jump+crouch is allowed and some others that doesnt change the physics of the game
highsjump was removed by valve in the last patch
quick fire, quick det, remove weapon is forbidden
cl_interp is allowed, u can use the value cl_interp 0.xxx with xxx beeing ur ping, for example if u have ping 60-65 use cl_interp 0.060, default is 0.1 aka ping 100 :)
Hmmm, how do you check the cfg of the other team while spectating ? I idn’t know that this was possible. Can you tell me how to do it ?
I just want to add, that it sometimes difficult to know if someone uses a script. One of our players is regularily accused of using the jump-duck script, but he doesn’t, he is doing it “manually”.
2Mumm.lu: you can dwnload aequitas files from ESL match’s media (you’ll find cfg in archive)
About jump+crouch: some players just formed a habit of doing this. If you played any other multiplayer FPS (for example: quake 1,2,3; halflife:ag; Unreal Tournament), then you must know bunny-hopping tricks and same things, that boost-up your movement speed.
I know lots of people doing crouch+jump manually from force of habit; it helps you to keep yourself in tonus during the match.
***update:
Any way of removing wpn model is forbidden?
We can use “cl_bobcycle 0” instead of “cl_bobcycle 0.8” (default).
Or we can use cl_drawview_model (or smthing, dont remember).. Afaik – 1st way isnt forbidden?
Removing the weapon model from the screen is forbidden? Why? It doesn’t give much of an advantage. Might as well ban widescreen resolutions then because they give a bit similar boost your field of view.
I play with the weapon model visible myself because it can get confusing not to see it but I know many players are used to playing without it. It’s allowed in every other game I’ve played and this is actually the first time I hear someone considering it cheating.
“high jump” script is probably the exploit that was making you jump higher (fixed with the pyro update).
Well, since there is no anti cheat program when you play ETF2L matches, it would be hard to know if a player really has a script or not.
You can only know when you see their Aequitas log on ESL like said above.
And, cl_interp has NOTHING to do with your ping.
People are sometimes whining about this, because in HL1 engine there was the “ex_interp” cvar. A while ago, you could exploit it to see people before they came or something similar (I don’t know exactly because I’ve never used it). Then, when Steam came out, VALVe fixed it, but some people still think you can exploit it etc.
If you want to know what it is, check “Entity Interpolation” :
http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Source_Multiplayer_Networking
Rapid fire sticky (hold a button to fire, detonate stickies midair in close combat)
This is banned from both ESL and ETF2L, ESL have an upperhand where they can see players configs through aequitas, I suggest you report any thing you see to the ESL admins who can then confirm or decline when they see the facts!
Hide weapon setting (just a flag to set to 0 to remove weapon.. dont know if this is considered a cheat.. heard someone claiming so a while back.. ).
There “is” a command to do this I believe, cant remember what it is as I’ve never felt the need to use it (I prefere having a rocket launcher there for some reason, use it to line up long distance rockets..) – It is not a banned command and I personally can see no reason to ban it.
Various autoreload-scripts(doubt that this is a cheat:P might as well check though).
As it stands it is not a banned script. (type +reload in console if your a sol…)
cl_interp (ok, i still dont understand what this setting does.. people seem to whine about it from time to time.. which values are allowed?)
I wouldn’t worry about max/min settings as all leagues have a .cfg which sets these, so even if you try and make your interp lower, it will lock at the lowest allowed setting.
See the next post down for a great description on what interp does :)
Things like duck/jump script are not banned as doesn’t really give you an unfair advantage, infact in some cases it has a negative impact.
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On a final note, if you do see/find any really dodgey scripts out on the net (trust me I’ve found quite a few that are really “lol people use that crap?”), please, please, please, get in touch with an admin in #etf2l.
Well, I have 2 things to say:
1.) I agree completely with Moose, why should playing without weapons visible be forbidden? It’s a graphics setting which can neither be controlled nor should be a matter to anyone but the player himself. In fact every earlier game I played without weapon model in view because it’s normally just annyoing. In TF2 I play with weapon model because the reloads are too irritating else and the rockets start off to a side so I rather like to see the launcher. But I don’t see any reason why it shouldn’t be allowed to play without, and it can’t be controlled anyway as long as you don’t use aequitas.
2.) cl_interp has no effect anymore anyhow afaik, it was replaced with cl_interp_ratio, so as long as that is set, changing cl_interp won’t have any effect. And cl_interp_ratio sets your cl_interp to the best value according to your updaterate, which is in fact the deciding factor, not the ping. The link above is helpful also, there’s a big developer entry about the theme.
cl_interp_ratio is limited between 1 and 1.5 by the ETF2L config too, because some people still think it can be used to gain an advantage, which the guy who posted right in front of me correctly set right.
All cl_interp does is to set a delay between the transmission of data from server to client and the draw of the picture on your monitor. So if you had no interp value, you’d get shown every update immediately on your screen, which would make all objects jerk around on your screen without any smooth movement and make it impossible for you to predict any movement or something. By delaying the display on your screen for 2 updates, your computer can calculate and predict the movement and display a smooth animation which makes the game life-like.
That’s all interpolation really does, since the exploit was fixed long ago it’s nothing miraculous about it. The only thing you had to take into account earlier was that cl_interp was set by default to an updaterate of 20, so you had 100 ms delay between data transfer and display on your screen. With a higher updaterate you can lower that to like 25 or 30 ms delay, which is an advantage. But since cl_interp_ratio was introduced (and it’s by default set to 1 in your config), it’s not necessary anymore to fiddle with it at all.
“cl_interp has no effect anymore anyhow afaik, it was replaced with cl_interp_ratio, so as long as that is set, changing cl_interp won’t have any effect.”
Wrong.
cl_interp was first removed in the Old source engine, and they put it back in the Orange Box engine, and it is 100% working.
They even added a line “lterp” in net_graph, so you can see what’s your current interp.
cl_interp_ratio/cl_updaterate= minimum cl_interp
Ok, so you can still increase your own graphics lag, but it won’t affect your cmdupdate or other communication with the server, so it won’t give you any advantage.
You can’t set it lower than the optimum value, you can only artificially increase it, but for that you could also change your cl_interp_ratio.
And all it would do is show you what’s happening on the server later than necessary, so you’d react somewhat belated.
In fact I had read on several dev logs it’s displayed but not effective, but if it is, you can irritate other people by moving a bit weird due to yourself seeing stuff belated, but the server won’t be fooled by any setting so you won’t appear lagged to other players. So I don’t really see there any cheating possibilites.
Thanks for all the replies, clears things up :).
Seems there is a discussion to be had regarding the removal of the weapon model though. Could be an idea to raise this issue and have a public vote or something?
Wlv, i can drop you a line regarding which scripts/cfgs looked wacky. Wont bother to hunt down the esl admins as this thread was never intended to be a witchhunt of any kind, rather just an attempt to clear out what is considered to be a cheat or not.
(sorry for my crappy grammar, cant think straight atm :) ).
Sajh, that would be great, I should be on from around about 19CET, I’m at work at the moment so can’t see my IRC :(
lol how can a client side variable be classed as cheating? Its a variable accessible for every clients p.c.
I suppose we can’t change our sensitivity next on our mice aye? loltastic at some of these theories by people who raise them!
Cheers
Byte
The option to remove weapons shouldn’t be a mtter of public voting in ETF2L. It’s a client-side command that everyone can use, and in my opinion it’s up the the individual player if he wishes to use it or not.
Duck-Jump and Fast-Fire are probably the most problematic scripts. Unless you have a progrem that monitors the CFGs, similar to ESL’S Aequitas, you can never know if the player is actually using them or not. Restricting those causes problems. I do agree that Fast-Fire should be banned, but without the program I mentioned earlier, it’ll create some problems.
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