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Don troll, BIOTCH

somehow you’re more annoying as a poster than you were as a medic who ran into walls

I blame the FaN for that

I’m done, might as well go talk to the wall.

HF with your cryfest.

I’m done, might as well go talk to the wall.

HF with your cryfest.

You are a joke man. Never learned to debate at school? Or did they teach you to go for personal attacks or leave the discussion?

So now we’re back on the topic of whether or not the FaN is imba? We had this discussion, for weeks on end. Then there were polls, the community decided not to ban the FaN.

GG, get over it already.

The FaN isn’t imba.
It’s annoying.

Dying is annoying.
Demoman spam is annoying.
Sentry guns on last are annoying.
When your medic dies with uber it’s annoying.
Scouts are annoying.
The spies ambassador gun sound is annoying.
Spies are annoying.
Good snipers are annoying.

You know where I’m going with this rite?

Shintaz FaN whine is annoying?

:D:D

Since I’m bored, here’s my input on this.

Quick list of my thoughts on FaN:

-Imbalanced
-Doesn’t fit game philosophy
-Frustrating
-Ruins game dynamics
-Dumbs down competitive play
-Removes variety from gameplay instead of adding it

Why is it imbalanced?

Despite being reasonably well balanced in terms of damage output across all ranges, only marignally better than scatter gun in this respect, the FaN is inherently imbalanced for two main reasons:

1. Much easier to use than scattergun, requiring less skill and consistency to use effectively. The stun is clearly the main reason for this, second to that is the faster firing rate aiding an easy second shot and thirdly, a slightly higher base damage output in general.
2. Temporarily removes opponents ability to react in a way that could change outcome or shift the advantage, essentially making opponent a sitting duck.

Not only does stun mean that the second shot becomes incredibly easy, but it also makes it much more difficult and at times impossible for opponent to respond the way he could to scatter both in terms of movement and aim.

Classic example is a low damage hit on opponent in mid air, stopping them dead in horizontal trajectory, unable to do anything movement wise besides fall back to the ground in a straight line after being suspended temporarily at a certain height, setting up an easy second shot.

Another would be simply shooting a grounded opponent such as a medic, launching him up temporarily, unable to dodge or react in any useful way, leaving him at the mercy of the FaN scout’s second shot.

In terms of aim impact on opponent, its particularly bad versus other scouts. FaN shot knocks aim off unexpectedly so oppponent has to constantly re-adjust aim when shot. Since scout is a fast moving class a lot of players are used to using movement to aid their aim. FaN stops the movement dead and puts it out of the control of player, making it more difficult for opposing scout whilst simultaneously making it easier to aim for the FaN scout.

This ties into my second key point:

Why doesn’t FaN fit game philosophy?

Valve have said explicitly themselves that they intend to follow a game design philosophy that tries to avoid situations where a player gets frustrated because he feels there is nothing he could have done to change the outcome. This is how people feel towards the FaN, much in the same way they did towards Sandman.

Robin Walker on Sniper class:

Dying to someone you weren’t engaged with, especially when you were already engaged with someone else, was aggravating. Even worse was dying to someone who you couldn’t have engaged with, even if you chose to. In that case, you’re very unlikely to believe you could have done anything differently to survive.

The stun effect is just an incredibly bad game mechanic for fps in general and definitely in TF2. Most people agreed that stun shouldn’t be in fps games when discussing the Sandman yet the FaN basically has the same impact on movement, all be it for a shorter length of time.

How does the FaN ruin gameplay?

Well for a start, there are situations when a FaN scout is practically infallible in terms of counters. Obvious example is sitting on badlands spire where every main class excluding demoman has almost no chance of jumping onto spire or killing the scout. Obviously TF2 has been designed to accommodate a lot of situational advantage/disadvantage between classes in different scenarios which is a good thing and promotes teamwork and tactical gameplay on an individual basis, but with FaN it’s SO strong in some scenarios that it should be considered game-breaking in my opinion.

When used on defence the mere presence of a FaN scout pretty much outlaws a lot of potential attacking and harassing opportunities. To put it simply the FaN removes a lot of variety in tactical gameplay by limiting other players to a more restricted and passive playstyle.

Consider it from the perspective of an aggressive, harassing style scout. Often these players will take calculated risks to harass an enemy team or player, moving into areas that are usually well defended in order to distract opponents and even perhaps find an opening to make a pick on the medic or demo. This can work well on the basis that the aggressive scout maintains a position where he can escape without being killed but requires playing near the limits of risk/reward. Problem is that the simple presence of a FaN scout means the risk is not worth taking anymore. All it takes is a single shot from him to knock you and your chances of escape are hugely reduced, most likely resulting in death.

There are many other examples of how FaN has this sort of impact on game dynamics, particularly those related to aggressive and risk taking play which before the FaN could often be successful but becomes entirely stupid versus a team using FaN scout(s).

It dumbs down competitive play because it negates the aim skill emphasis for those scouts who have exceptional aim and like to use Scattergun but now are not so superior, or not at all when playing against a FaN scout with totally average aim.

But by far the main reason I don’t like this weapon, is how it has forced the metagame to change into a form that is just blatantly LESS FUN and MORE FRUSTRATING with LESS VARIETY.

Quoting so more people read this. So less “LOL POLL LOL” plx

although the FaN has been tweaked a bit, its still really annoying in the way it restricts your movement, personally i dislike it even more than the sandman. Gets frustrating when you get sucker punched with the 2nd shot and the 1st barely hurt you.

Then don’t meet a FaN scout round a corner.

There’s so many ways to counter a FaN scout, it’s just because it’s quite ‘new’ and a lot of players haven’t worked out the methods yet.

A quick example is the ‘save your double jump’ when you are a scout fighting against a FaN scout. Against a regular scout, a lot of people often recommend you don’t double jump as you become a sitting duck while you are in the air. Against a FaN scout I find it’s best to jump for many reasons. 1) If he hits you, you are a sitting duck anyway so you aren’t losing anything by jumping. 2) If you jump, and he hits his first shot, quickly use your double jump. You will still get hit, but most of the time it puts the player off of getting that snd shot meatshot. Providing the first shot isn’t a dead on meatshot (which most of the time it isn’t), their 2nd shot won’t do enough damage to kill you. Asuming you can aim, you will have the advantage while he is reloading and should be able to get the 1 or 2 shots left you need to finish him off.

I myself prefer fighting against FaN scouts, unless I have to jump up to the spire, then I wish they weren’t using that gun, but other than that, I find FaN scouts are a lot easier to kill than a regular scattergun scout.

Then don’t meet a FaN scout round a corner.

There’s so many ways to counter a FaN scout, it’s just because it’s quite ‘new’ and a lot of players haven’t worked out the methods yet.

A quick example is the ‘save your double jump’ when you are a scout fighting against a FaN scout. Against a regular scout, a lot of people often recommend you don’t double jump as you become a sitting duck while you are in the air. Against a FaN scout I find it’s best to jump for many reasons. 1) If he hits you, you are a sitting duck anyway so you aren’t losing anything by jumping. 2) If you jump, and he hits his first shot, quickly use your double jump. You will still get hit, but most of the time it puts the player off of getting that snd shot meatshot. Providing the first shot isn’t a dead on meatshot (which most of the time it isn’t), their 2nd shot won’t do enough damage to kill you. Asuming you can aim, you will have the advantage while he is reloading and should be able to get the 1 or 2 shots left you need to finish him off.

I myself prefer fighting against FaN scouts, unless I have to jump up to the spire, then I wish they weren’t using that gun, but other than that, I find FaN scouts are a lot easier to kill than a regular scattergun scout.

and we have a winner.