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What ya gonna do AC team?
Created 19th January 2011 @ 09:27
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Quoted from Tikcus
some people have been banned from etf2l that were not cheating
True.
Last edited by M0re,
Quoted from Warmaster
[…]
edit: I’m way too slow :(
I thought you’d never realize :D
No personal attacks or pointless replies anymore from anybody. Keep it ontopic or it gets locked.
Last edited by Buffalo Bill,
Are there any AC admins willing to comment on anything on this thread? For example transparency, as that seems the main issue of contention.
Quoted from Buffalo Bill
No personal attacks or pointless replies anymore from anybody. Keep it ontopic or it gets locked.
Going to need to delete a whole lot more posts in this thread then :p
Quoted from CrashSite
Are there any AC admins willing to comment on anything on this thread? For example transparency, as that seems the main issue of contention.
Simple. All need to agree before a ban is placed. If that’s not the case, no ban.
Quoted from Buffalo Bill
[…]
Simple. All need to agree before a ban is placed. If that’s not the case, no ban.
Well, an agreement sure is simple, but it doesn’t guarantee that the decision is 100% correct, The multi-accounting ban for Forza for example: It has just been said that he’s banned, and what for, however, we have no idea about how this decision was made has he been contacted himself by an etf2l admin to explain on what exact part of the situation they based their situation? To prevent decisions being questions, it might actually be interesting to put up the standard procedure that are being applied for bans for the different reasons (like who’s to be contacted, whether the person complaining about possible cheating and the person accused are contacted before, during and after the check of the demo etc).
Not to justify the AC team for what they’re doing, because, as said already, they don’t need to give any explanation to anyone for anything they do, but it might help the players in ETF2L have more faith in what they do and especially in the fact that they listened to all parties involved
Quoted from Dr Icecream
[…]
Well, an agreement sure is simple, but it doesn’t guarantee that the decision is 100% correct, The multi-accounting ban for Forza for example: It has just been said that he’s banned, and what for, however, we have no idea about how this decision was made has he been contacted himself by an etf2l admin to explain on what exact part of the situation they based their situation? To prevent decisions being questions, it might actually be interesting to put up the standard procedure that are being applied for bans for the different reasons (like who’s to be contacted, whether the person complaining about possible cheating and the person accused are contacted before, during and after the check of the demo etc).
Not to justify the AC team for what they’re doing, because, as said already, they don’t need to give any explanation to anyone for anything they do, but it might help the players in ETF2L have more faith in what they do and especially in the fact that they listened to all parties involved
1. It can never be 100% correct.
2. They don’t need to “restore faith” in some idiots who couldn’t see their mate was hacking.
3. If you still question these decisions, join the team yourself and have a say in how things work.
-End-
Quoted from Buffalo Bill
No personal attacks or pointless replies anymore from anybody. Keep it ontopic or it gets locked.
No your wrong
Spike sometimes it’s better not to comment. I think we got your opinion about demsii. There’s no need to go and on. It’s really starts to bore now. I think you are a good guy so just leave it be and stay helpful :)
OT: The AC team does a hard and really unrewarding job. Whatever they do they can’t please the community. Much respect for still putting so much effort into this. I’m also all for keeping the catching methods secret but this requires much depth and experience in this field. On the contrary admins tend to leave and quit quicker than elsewhere in a result of all the rants of hate here in the forums. Guess you guys know where this is going to. So just let us all be a bit more constructive and polite.
I would first like to point out that I am not an AC admin, and since I’m a new admin, I am not referring to myself when talking about admins.
Quoted from CrashSite
Are there any AC admins willing to comment on anything on this thread? For example transparency, as that seems the main issue of contention.
AC admins should basically make cheating easier and increase the amount of flaming (which is what would happen when non-experienced players look at some of the evidence), just because some people think that their own experience with the cheaters (e.g. “I played against him once, he seemed like a nice guy, so I don’t think he’s cheating”) might be more evidence than what they think the AC admins based their decision on?
I find it ridiculous that some people have “lost faith in the AC team”, when they have nothing to base that on. We’ve seen two cases be discussed the most over the past days: forzaeagle and BeaVerN.
With the evidence at hand, no reasonable person would think that forzaeagle is innocent. He lied in his thread (which had the main purpose of trash-talking his former teammates) and anyone who defended him was fooled by a trickster. There’s nothing more to it.
Regarding BeaVerN, some people think the banned happened like this:
– Admins get an AC call regarding BeaVerN.
– They look through a demo and see that he’s playing very well, even though he’s only playing in a low division.
– They can’t believe he’s that good, so they just ban him.
– Some people in the community point out that BeaVerN has experience from Left 4 Dead.
– The admins realize that he might have been that good without cheating, because he was good at Left 4 Dead.
– The admins realize that their only piece of evidence (BeaVerN being a good low div player) doesn’t hold at all.
– Even though the admins realize that they’re wrong, they refuse to unban him, because they can’t admit that they did something wrong.
I’m serious, that’s what a lot of you in these threads think, and it’s ridiculous. I just wish people would actually think their arguments through before posting. Why? Because for every negative comment directed towards an admin, five positive comments have to be made to keep the admin content and not quit his voluntary, non-paying job. For example, do you think that game developers read through their game forums? Large game studios hire people who’s sole task is to read through everything ever written about a specific game, filter out all the bullshit, and hand it over to the game developers. Sadly, the ETF2L admins are very much part of the competitive community, and can’t avoid the forums. Nor can they waste man-power on such a task. That means they actually read all the nonsensical criticism that is directed towards them, and it doesn’t exactly motivate them to keep wasting most of their free time on the community.
Being an admin is the most thankless job imaginable in the community. Have a look at other community contributors, mappers and modders for example. My friend Rob got $40 000 after two weeks of his polycount pack being released. God knows how much he’s gotten in total. He spent only 1 week designing the items. He also got e-fame, a polycount pin, a community weapon, special versions of his own weapons and stuff like that. Even mappers get paid (first a lump sum, then through stamps) if they’re lucky enough to have their map included in the official map pool.
Admins, on the other hand, get absolutely nothing except the occasional recognition. Their christmas bonus consists of flame, threats and insults. Even RaCio had to bloody pay through his own pockets to rent a specific server for ETF2L.
Almost none of the people who agree with the admins’ decisions have shared their view in these threads, but we’ve seen a couple of dozen people complain about the AC admins and how they’ve lost faith in them. You think that’s a good way of keeping competent AC admins? No, we’ll have them quit (just like in the past). But I don’t know, maybe most people don’t want cheaters to get caught, maybe they’re masochists who like playing against wallhackers and aimbotters.
It’s not the first time something like that happens; someone gets banned for cheating, and a bunch of loud-mouths with nothing better to do start defending the cheater. Not because they believe him, just for the sake of it. It gets quite ridiculous when the cheater admits to cheating (in private to the admins), but lets his supporters carry on the crusade, or when the evidence is overwhelming but people just refuse to believe it.
99 % certainty is not good enough!
Yes, it is. It’s incredibly good and much better than any judicial system in the world.
Admins should be able to admit when they’ve banned someone wrongfully!
Of course they should. The problem is that you don’t know when you’ve banned someone wrongfully. In the latest bans, has there been anything at all that changes the prerequisites with which the admins banned any of the players? No. The AC admins saw something that definitely looked like cheats, and I can’t even imagine anything changing that. Can you? Because stuff like “he’s a nice guy” or “he was good at Left 4 Dead” or “it’s just because he’s low div” definitely won’t change the fact that his demos (to the experienced eye) portrayed a cheater.
It might not be smart to answer people who don’t have any interest in having a constructive discussion (e.g. half the people in here, who just spew out nonsense without thinking it through), but I had to get some things off my chest.
Quoted from ashkan
For example, do you think that game developers read through their game forums? Large game studios hire people who’s sole task is to read through everything ever written about a specific game, filter out all the bullshit, and hand it over to the game developers.
hey this is what i do for a living don’t bash it :((((((((((
sole task bit is wrong though, cms usually have other roles too
JUST SAYIN
Last edited by kuma,
Quoted from kuma
[…]
hey this is what i do for a living don’t bash it :((((((((((
sole task bit is wrong though, cms usually have other roles too
JUST SAYIN
I’m not bashing it, it’s great! :D
Thanks.
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