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Hmm, the no rocket trail thing I don’t use myself but I think its perfectly acceptable really, the overheal sign is umm a bit borderline really, just beacause you can’t see it in game is not a excuss to alter the game so you can. Its like saying I can see the players properly I think I will use chams (coloured models) so I can.

The demo stickys one is crossing the line, are you telling me you have never been caught by a surprise sticky trap fluffy? You would have to be very nieve to not see the advantage in that. Its one thing thinking the way ahead is clear of stickys its quite another being sure.

LAWL overheal: http://www.gotfrag.com/tf2/forums/thread/406184/

Thing is, lots of (american) comp players have been using stuff like this for quite some time…

And so have lots of euros…

Cool, now show the proof. I am so glad you’re stepping up and telling everyone you know of people cheating in etf2l/wireplay/mpuktf2-pickup and whatnot, since this will be so interesting to read. Thank you again, Eon!

Bring on the list of cheaters! Let them have it!

cheaters? Where does it say it’s cheating to use modificated particles? I know it is a bit problematic as removing the smoke trail from a rocket gives much less advantage compared to seeing sticky bomb blinking particles from behind the corner but technically it’s still the same thing as custom crosshairs. We use sv_pure 2 to prevent the modification of objects/textures/sounds and stuff we shouldn’t be able to modify. These particles just have been and are currently legal so I would be pretty cautious talking about cheating.

cheaters? Where does it say it’s cheating to use modificated particles? I know it is a bit problematic as removing the smoke trail from a rocket gives much less advantage compared to seeing sticky bomb blinking particles from behind the corner but technically it’s still the same thing as custom crosshairs. We use sv_pure 2 to prevent the modification of objects/textures/sounds and stuff we shouldn’t be able to modify. These particles just have been and are currently legal so I would be pretty cautious talking about cheating.

Here I am, not being careful at all but quite clear and aggressive:

There is _no_ difference between big blinking stickybombs or using spiked models.

Spiked models for player and grenades has been considered cheating for over ten years in what is the somewhat wonderful concept of TeamFortress, what suddenly changed? Please, do enlighten me.

You also need to know why this is activated. This was blacklisted a while ago, but (and now I _quote_ from the changelog, because you’d think I was kidding) then this change turned up:

“Removed consistency check for some particle systems that players like to customize”

Quickly some individuals noted that they screwed this up in a big way (kudos to AnAkIn) and posted on the appropriate lists.

I do not know why this was not immediately given appropriate concern — BUT I HAVE A PRETTY GOOD GUESS! People I do not wish to mention by name (since that would be cruel and evil — and that’s not me!), but are frequent around these parts, has been sending… less than insightful mails to these lists. Where devs used to frequent in the past. Now they do not. Wonder why? Thanks a bunch.

Next up, “Added instant death-weapons that homes around corners randomly, that players might like to shoot every once in a while”.

Fluffy Meowington, ok, so, let’s do this too, and why not remove some walls, with video card tweaks to gain some FPS, even if you see players behind them, this is probably not cheating since this is only some video card tweaks.

And why not use a shit video card with bugguy drivers that also let you see through walls, this is not cheating, it’s the drivers!!!!!!

And how is ‘wallhacking’ the same as using low quality explosions?
I see no similarity beyond…actually I see no similarity at all.
If you were referring to my previous statement regarding stickies then you must have misunderstood because

The demo stickys one is crossing the line, are you telling me you have never been caught by a surprise sticky trap fluffy? You would have to be very nieve to not see the advantage in that. Its one thing thinking the way ahead is clear of stickys its quite another being sure.

I agree with the sticky thing being borderline cheating but all I’m saying is that there’s no need for a witchhunt.

why should he? You don’t show any proof of cheating here so…

Incorrect. Proof is shared between many leagues AC-teams.

Fluffy Meowington, ok, so, let’s do this too, and why not remove some walls, with video card tweaks to gain some FPS, even if you see players behind them, this is probably not cheating since this is only some video card tweaks.

ಠิ_ಠิ
Someone here didn’t hear about occlusion culling.

FireStorm, there is a rule that you see in every gaming league (maybe it’s not really clear in ETF2L rules, but I guess it is more in some other leagues), which is something like:

Any modifications to models/textures/sounds or using custom files are not allowed (this doesn’t count .cfg files ofc). This count particles, which nobody should have had modified, but a lot of people broke this rule.

@gryzor
(too long to quote)

I have completely missed the changelog from that part even though I usually read it on updates. That’s why I assumed it hasn’t ever been blacklisted.

The league rules don’t separately forbid any special modifications that are allowed by the engine. There is a rule about bug abusing and stuff but this is whitelisted feature so it couldn’t be really considered as abuse. An even though this kind of modifications _have been_ considered as cheating, in ETF2L it currently isn’t unless the rules are changed (btw, I’m up for the change). For many people this isn’t de facto cheating and discussing on the forums wether it’s _currently_ cheating or not, doesn’t help much. Instead I would suggest that the rules are changed to make this thin clear. It’s kind of obvious that the change to blacklisting was a bit fuckup for sure since eg. that sticky bomb modification is somewhat much more than “a little thing people want to modify”…