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I, for one, think that soldier self-damage should be tweaked, as it’s retardedly high at times, but that’s a discussion for another time.

Gunboats?

I really don’t think using unlockables to balance classes is the way to go.

Wasn’t that the general idea of TF2 Beta – like choosing comp. players, who will objectively judge updates, make everything totaly competitive friendly? These updates aren’t concentrated only on one group of people, like only PUB or only comp. they’re just generally FUN.

TF2 Beta was an exercise in futility, any suggestion which would in anyway seem to bridge the gap between scouts/demomen and the rest of the classes for competitive play was rendered useless by pages and pages of negative posts from scouts would did not want to see their influence diminish. Even something as simple as reducing self-damage back to its original levels (pre-pyro patch) was shot down in flames.

You get a rocket launcher that 1-shots scouts and you’re still whining?

My result of this thread : You can’t discuss things at these (public) forums, sadly.

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Wasn’t that the general idea of TF2 Beta – like choosing comp. players, who will objectively judge updates, make everything totaly competitive friendly? These updates aren’t concentrated only on one group of people, like only PUB or only comp. they’re just generally FUN.

TF2 Beta was an exercise in futility, any suggestion which would in anyway seem to bridge the gap between scouts/demomen and the rest of the classes for competitive play was rendered useless by pages and pages of negative posts from scouts would did not want to see their influence diminish. Even something as simple as reducing self-damage back to its original levels (pre-pyro patch) was shot down in flames.

You get a rocket launcher that 1-shots scouts and you’re still whining?

I’m on your side, read up. I want it banned.

You want it banned “cause it’s useless”. gglogic.

If you ban the direct hit ban the FaN aswell…ALL THE FKIN POOLS SAY SO

Christ fragga, most scouts actually agreed on tweaking self-damage, just not the retarded amount the soldiers wanted.
The soldiers wanted the selfdamage to return to it’s original level or worse.
hardly any penalty for shooting the floor in desperation like a complete mong when you got shot in the back.

I don’t want it banned because it’s useless. It acts similar to the FAN inasmuch as it benefits lesser players – take airshots for example – now they’re too easy, easy with a substantial reward of basically an instagib, whereas the old launcher takes a double punishment 1. no mini-crits and 2. fall-off damage.

Yes, cause it’s all about the airshots. You might have noticed most want the minicrits to be gone anyways. With regards to the “basically hitscan” comment (don’t know if you made it) all I want to say is that the normal RL also is basically hitscan up to the length of a teleporter. Now it’s 2 teleporters. 1.5 for demo nades. After that it’s all prediction. And with the old rl it is easier to keep doing damage because you just need to hit the floor (where everybody aim at ranges where it’s hard to hit direct on). When somebody tries to hit you with the tdh you still can strafe out irregularly to make people miss (esp for scout/med/demo). Just like with the demo nades. With the normal rl you still would have done damage. It’s a pick weapon, not a weapon to spam rockets at the ground to juggle and then go for the direct hits (ie how the old rl works at anything beyond pretty much 3 meters).

I love how you wanted faster rockets, just like in Quake, but now they have arrived you think they suck. Not overpowered enough for you (or maybe they are, since you want them to see banned?)? I bet you were hoping for fast nuclear missles or something.