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Allowing a few unlocks?
Created 7th June 2012 @ 11:42
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Didn’t read through the whole thread so apologies if this has been posted.
I’d just like to point out a few factual errors in your first 2 posts, Mightyme.
“No one would rune double gunboats” – Wrong. The top team in NATF2 (Flow) ran double gunboats for entire matches towards the end of the year
“No one would run double boston basher” – Actually, not a single invite team this season didn’t have both scouts equipped with the basher. Also, the idea that it’s used to lesson advantages is false. In NA tf2, it’s used to *increase* advantages because you build uber faster than with solly/demo, if you watch actual matches you notice that most teams have a designated scout ‘builder’ who builds uber even when both soldiers and the demo are up (demo isn’t the most effective at building, double gunboats makes it hard to build uber). Using the flow example, if you watch pyyyour’s stream during matches and scrims you notive that Shrugger is often used to build uber even when the pocket Harbleu is up (even if he has shotty).
You really have to look at the difference in the styles of play between NA and EU. in NA, teams will often push with ~10% advantage, while in Europe it’s not uncommon for teams to not push on a 30% advantage.
People have this idea that unlocks shape the style of play, it’s really the opposite. EU is suited to vanilla because of the slower style of gameplay, whereas unlocks work better in the NA scene because of their faster pace of play.
P.S. – watch pirate radio to hear cbear’s opinion of the gunboats, and you realize that they’re not actually as popular in the NA scene.
tl;dr: you really need to watch top level NA matches, not play a few pugs, to see the true effect of unlocks on the game.
Quoted from M24_
lolong
Alright then,the boston basher shouldn’t be allowed, I agree with you totally.
But why not having one soldier that uses gunboats? I think it can’t have that much of an effect or a change of playstyle.
Last edited by Godof,
Having a solly get to mid almost as fast as a demo and with almost full health doesn’t effect gameplay? GG
no it doesn’t, because hes still not as fast as a demo. even then, he only has 3 rockets to deal damage with which is laughable. hardly anyteam does this kind of strat anyway.
Last edited by Sasuke,
Quoted from Monkeh
Skill level shall be raised as I shall quit the game. It’s already pretty easy to bomb medics…why make it easier?
I watched
Nah, we just allow you to die fast to make you think that in matches
Quoted from M24_
Didn’t read through the whole thread so apologies if this has been posted.
……
tl;dr: you really need to watch top level NA matches, not play a few pugs, to see the true effect of unlocks on the game.
I think that post says it all tbh, we have a different style to the NA (and the AU) scene, and lets go into the “but we had unlocks before so it cant be because of vanilla that we are slower pace” thing. We made the game play slow, having unlocks is just going to make the already slow gameplay by us EU players slower. And Im not saying that the unlocks make the NA/AU scene slower then its already fast pace, because it doesnt
Quoted from Skully
[…]
Nah, we just allow you to die fast to make you think that in matches
[…]
I think that post says it all tbh, we have a different style to the NA (and the AU) scene, and lets go into the “but we had unlocks before so it cant be because of vanilla that we are slower pace” thing. We made the game play slow, having unlocks is just going to make the already slow gameplay by us EU players slower. And Im not saying that the unlocks make the NA/AU scene slower then its already fast pace, because it doesnt
Yes, allowing gunboats would make the game even slower.
Makes perfect sense.
Quoted from Sasuke
[…]
Yes, allowing gunboats would make the game even slower.
Makes perfect sense.
Im not on about JUST gunboats, Im on about other stuff like the Equalizer and bonk
Yeah I know, lets make our game interesting with constant stalemates of Player B getting pwned by Player A so they hae to get out using their unlocks instead of using their normal brain and normal weapons to escape and maybe die, thus creating a pick and a chance for a push
See what I did there
Quoted from Sasuke
no it doesn’t, because hes still not as fast as a demo. even then, he only has 3 rockets to deal damage with which is laughable. hardly anyteam does this kind of strat anyway.
As mentioned earlier Mercy, I watched an American team only last week playing at LANfest with a gunboats roamer, it was his POV that I was watching. Buff to 300, jump, jump, jump, jump and arrive with around 200-220.
He was actually waiting on mid for the enemy medic, he arrived almost the same time as the demo, he pwned the medic practically every round…and then jumped away practically every round and got to safety. It was the most huge turn off to watch as a medic.
In fact fuck turn off, it was horrible, scary and downright distressing. Never in a million years would I find this game fun it I had a gunboats solly jumping around our team like a frantic jack in the box on acid, strafing all over the place and taking like 10 health per jump. It was bullshit.
The 3 rockets thing…ermm, I reckon even I could re-load mid jump.
Gunboats allowed would = lots of medics either change class or give up. I bet a hundred million dollars.
American medics deal with it, EU medics need to up their game.
Also, the EU game is always going to be slow paced because EU players are scared not because of unlocks. Unlocks would be nice and would unlock another facet of different strategies but until EU stops playing like pussies the game will always be a stalemate.
Thing about lanfest is about 50% of those players were basically pubbers… Don’t take that gunboats play as typical.
I just don’t see why we should add unlocks specifically to make medics easier to kill. It’s all well and good thinking about the speed of the game, but you do have to see the point of the medics, it’s going to lessen the fun for them.
Last edited by MEGAMIDDIE,
Quoted from Monkeh
[…]
As mentioned earlier Mercy, I watched an American team only last week playing at LANfest with a gunboats roamer, it was his POV that I was watching. Buff to 300, jump, jump, jump, jump and arrive with around 200-220.
He was actually waiting on mid for the enemy medic, he arrived almost the same time as the demo, he pwned the medic practically every round…and then jumped away practically every round and got to safety. It was the most huge turn off to watch as a medic.
In fact fuck turn off, it was horrible, scary and downright distressing. Never in a million years would I find this game fun it I had a gunboats solly jumping around our team like a frantic jack in the box on acid, strafing all over the place and taking like 10 health per jump. It was bullshit.
The 3 rockets thing…ermm, I reckon even I could re-load mid jump.
Gunboats allowed would = lots of medics either change class or give up. I bet a hundred million dollars.
Pure is a top prem player and a div1 capable solly. ofc he’ll look extremely good against a team that consists of div5/6 players and a low prem scout (and appreantly a demo with some league expereience)
he would have anal raped them even if he played revolver-only spy.
As for you saying that he reached mid before the demo, then the demo MUST have been slow. There is no way to reach mid before the demo on badlands, even with infinite health I think, feel free to prove me wrong with a video showing a soldier entering mid 9:45.
EDIT : we may have watched different games though, I was referring to the finals on badlands, still the same thing applies for all cp maps that are played in europe, you can’t reach mid before the demo.
EDIT #2 : i’m speaking of this game http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTaoQRBfNek&feature=plcp
Last edited by Sasuke,
Quoted from MEGAMIDDIE
I just don’t see why we should add unlocks specifically to make medics easier to kill. It’s all well and good thinking about the speed of the game, but you do have to see the point of the medics, it’s going to lessen the fun for them.
so you’re telling me if medic was much easier it would have been more fun?
your logic is flawed, pretty sure many medics find it fun to dodge soldier bombs, they like a challenge.
Quoted from Sasuke
[…]
feel free to prove me wrong with a video showing a soldier entering mid 9:45.
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