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Regarding the no mercs and wildcards rule for the Nations Cups (though I’ve only checked for highlander). All but one of the default win/losses in the highlander cup so far were caused by the lack of mercs and wildcards.

http://etf2l.org/matches/43483/
http://etf2l.org/matches/43486/
http://etf2l.org/matches/43471/
http://etf2l.org/matches/43474/
http://etf2l.org/matches/43456/
http://etf2l.org/matches/43454/

Since most nations only get three matches per cup it’s not ideal to lose 1/3 of matches in a cup that runs only once annually. No mercs or wildcards is harsh because ETF2L does not have a weekly default match day. i.e. if two team leaders can’t agree on a convenient day, or one team leader is simply awkward or is inactive, it’s a lottery as to who gets the most convenient default date. Therefore, facts on the ground reflect the rigidity of official match times with the illusion of flexibility.

On the other hand, if your country does not have enough good players regularly available then you are clearly not the best country and therefore the default loss reflects your low rank in the cup. However, I disagree with this philosophy as availability ≠ skill. Furthermore, we’re here to have fun and play highlander and the rules prevent some teams, particularly countries with smaller populations, from having fun and playing highlander. Therefore, countries with small populations (indeed, of TF2 players) are at an immediate disadvantage which while reflecting the letter of the law, as it were, i.e. the nation with the most highly skilled players should win, does not reflect the spirit of the cup which as far as I understand is to have fun and play highlander.

It is on this basis I propose the next Nations Highlander Cup (with similar, proportionate provisions for the 6v6 cup) allow up to 3 mercs if the opponent agrees with 1 wildcard provided to each national team.

Thanks.

For wildcards CanFo – It would have to be set up with more time to schedule delayed matches, in theory there would have to be a catch-up week that we can use. Otherwise as you mention, there isn’t enough time to do this otherwise we’d delay the tournament it’d overlap with future seasons / events and the workload for admins would increase dramatically to the point it becomes a part-time job, from a practical stand point it’s not workable without more time put aside for this.

I think there may be room to create an extra week next year to possibly reschedule but ultimately it is the responsility of the captain from both teams to communicate with eachother and organise their team to play, it is possible some teams can reschedule on certain days whilst some can not.

Agreed Quell – That is why as admins when we pick team captains we will always judge your committment and your ability to schedule games on time, if you manage a team that gave away a default loss, that would not favour you next time (although it wouldn’t necessarily be your fault, but we would still need to look at it).

This is why some captains were picked over others who were from previous Nations Cups – It is a lot of responsibility, it isn’t just an accolade to put on your Steam Profile.

Quoted from b33p

>If there is a player that you would let play for your national team, what is stopping you from adding him to the roster?

If you mean from the same nation, I refer back to my statement about some countries having an extremely small population of highlander players (which is why we’re using some people who haven’t even played a highlander season). It’s not an issue of the leader necessarily refusing to add highlander players to the roster on the basis they’re division 6, for example, it’s that for small countries the simple issue is that there may be literally 15 people who play highlander and within the restrictions of match fixtures as per the ETF2L rules, getting the majority of them together when real life does not interfere is Sisphean.

>Also, of the cases you listed, none of the match comments suggested that not being allowed to use a merc caused a forfeit. It was either that a nation had not enough players that evening in general or that a team simply did not show up at all (for whatever reason).

From what I know mercs and wildcards would have allowed these matches to be played, however some of what I have heard from players and through the grapevine may be inaccurate. If you are open to my recommendations if what I have stated is fact, I am willing to do the leg work and speak to all those team leaders and find out what the issues were with a view to amend the rules to avoid a repetition next year. Of course you can confirm before seriously considering making amendments.

>Regarding default dates: The default dates are far from being a lottery and usually reward the team that shows more effort to schedule the match.

It did not happen in my experience, however this may be due to the arbitrary deadline placed on playing our Week 5 match. I am on my mobile phone so that is awkward for me to investigate.

A catch up week would be too much to ask for? In any event, a wildcard during week 1 is better than none.

Edit: correcting my phone’s auto correct.

If you have 20 people on your roster and 9 can’t play, then you are choosing the wrong people. It’s understandable some people have things to do, but at the end of the day 11/20 busy that night? Maybe you should schedule a bit better as well and this wouldn’t be a problem. You know the situation when you sign up for the Nations Cups, you know how big your national community is. If playing matches is so hard, maybe you shouldn’t have signed up.

Of course mercs and wildcards would enable these matches to be played. The reasons for disallowing both of these have already been mentioned.

The default dates were most definitely not random. This is to prevent being biased towards a certain team, the default dates that were going to be given out were decided before the Cup began.

As has been said before, a catch up week would severely delay the competition, which has been scheduled to finish before i49. In your group of 5 you already had a week off, maybe you could have asked to play a game during that?

Quoted from b33p

I refer back to my statement about some countries having an extremely small population of highlander players (which is why we’re using some people who haven’t even played a highlander season).

we’ve got people on our roster that have never even played competitive period! ;)

honestly, if countries are too small to get enough people on a team you shouldn’t sign up. not really a nations cup if you have 6 irish players, 1 german, and 2 french people (just an example).

Quoted from CanFo

[…]
To wrap it up before i49 (referring back to the tight schedule that does not allow further delay, e.g. through wildcards).
The 6v6 NC started later than HL anyway so a break for i49 was inevitable anyway.

Out of interest, why was it decided that the HL nations cup had to finish before i49? You say it’s a tight schedule and that it overlaps with other competitions…but doesn’t it already overlap with the 6v6 Nations Cup? What other competitions are you referring to?

Also, I may be missing something, but doesn’t cramming more games into a shorter period of time create more work for admins during that period?

I have no issues with the Nations cup :X both of em

Quoted from Permzilla

[…]
The default dates were most definitely not random. This is to prevent being biased towards a certain team, the default dates that were going to be given out were decided before the Cup began.

As has been said before, a catch up week would severely delay the competition, which has been scheduled to finish before i49. In your group of 5 you already had a week off, maybe you could have asked to play a game during that?

Oh please. A week off? We had to play 4 matches in the space of about 15 days during which time the people who actually play highlander also had 2 UGC officials. What is this week off you’re referring to? Either way, there was a lot to squeeze in within a short period of time; 6 officials in just over two weeks if you’re willing to have a holistic view and accept that players into highlander are likely playing UGC.

There is disparity between how highlander is handled and how 6v6 is handled which is unfortunate. Not just with the short “weeks” and the cup, even the general league. ETF2L does highlander better than UGC but it’s only twice a year and the groups are tiny. I digress. I think it is reasonable to allow even two mercs and one wildcard, and schedule it better so it does not revolve around a 6v6 event (i49 basically).

Quoted from quell

[…]
we’ve got people on our roster that have never even played competitive period! ;)

This…this is a lie. One person, ‘Anne’! And the average number of matches played for each player in your team is about 60! Don’t be doggin’ on the small countries man, get outta here!