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pl_badwater_pro

Created 6th April 2015 @ 21:10

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Aero

Quoted from aura

fyi to all the people that reposted: by “ruining it” I meant that there could have been a legit _pro version with all the minor fixes one can dream of, including shadow fixes, fixing stairs dmg bug, altering respawn times, relocating metal and health in 3rd; and maybe even removing that celling above 3rd-to-4th choke just anything other that what has been proposed would have worked, sigh.

Not to be confrontational, but it would have been a great help if you had mentioned those potential fixes first, and then possibly discussed why you believed the current changes weren’t satisfactory.

In any case, thank you for the suggestions! What specific fixes did you have in mind regarding shadows, respawn times, and metal locations?

Spreijer

CONCORDIA

For me it’s one of the most boring maps in highlander, the third point is unnecessary over complicated and second is close to useless. Badwater is a good map, but I believe these changes could make it better, because I don’t think it’s really perfect.

Hartz has a good point there, it feels really cramped for attackers to make some sort of opening flankside.

SabaSaba

[hePPa]

I would also like to see the Musa exploit fixed in all comp maps. Badwater third point is unreachable by blu spy and this could be fixed by creating a wider staircase.

Upward last point 2nd floor is also a nightmare for spies.

EDIT: Selek and Tseini pretty much said this before me.


Last edited by SabaSaba,

Munky

AEUGH

This and this feel like too heavy handed changes. This is an interesting change that looks very good. In theory that walkway should make pushing slightly easier in a number of different ways. Hartz might be right about the change on first but I still feel like it could make second a better hold and makes falling all the way back to third weaker. I also like the second door on the forward spawn and little things like removing the sign that pops up.

As for changes you should try. Fixing the dispenser trick (where a dispenser stops a spy climbing the stairs on third) would make pushing significantly easier. Changing that alone would go a long way to fixing third. If that wasn’t enough then equalising heights between Upper Deck and Catwalks (as you called them) so they could be jumped.

Subtle changes rather than big ones are what is needed. Good luck.

aura

Quoted from Aero

[…]
Not to be confrontational, but it would have been a great help if you had mentioned those potential fixes first, and then possibly discussed why you believed the current changes weren’t satisfactory.

In any case, thank you for the suggestions! What specific fixes did you have in mind regarding shadows, respawn times, and metal locations?

I was being rude only because the changes you have shown clearly represent the lack of your map knowledge, thats it. Maybe it was unecessary on my part to act like this, but you also have to take into consideration the scope of work and responsibility that now lies on your shoulders considering that you pretty much reserved the “_pro” tag right now for yourself and it made me and also plenty of people slightly disappointed.

Aero

Quoted from aura

[…]

I was being rude only because the changes you have shown clearly represent the lack of your map knowledge, thats it. Maybe it was unecessary on my part to act like this, but you also have to take into consideration the scope of work and responsibility that now lies on your shoulders considering that you pretty much reserved the “_pro” tag right now for yourself and it made me and also plenty of people slightly disappointed.

I’m not the first one to use the _pro tag; TMP over at UGC attempted to make a Badwater pro a year or so ago. There’s no reason why there can’t be two competing models of a pro map; competition promotes innovation and sharing of ideas.

Additionally, even if the first edition of a badwater_pro isn’t satisfactory (as many people here seem to agree), there’s no reason for me to be unable to take into account reactions to my changes and revise accordingly. As Badwater isn’t “my” map, I have no personal investment here; all of the changes I’ve made thus far have been informed by conversations with and suggestions by other people. As I mentioned in the OP, I welcome constructive criticism, and never had any real reason to expect that this revision would be the final version to be (or not to be) accepted by any leagues for notable playing/playtesting.

I won’t respond to the quip about my map knowledge because I don’t want to derail this thread into a discussion of my qualifications.

So again, thank you for your feedback. I hope you will be able to provide additional specification on the fixes you wish to see in the map. The more perspectives I am able to take into account while working on this project, the better the final product will be.


Last edited by Aero,

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ahjhko7fIw92dGFYRUVVYy1yNGNReXV6TW9FNnlxa1E&usp=drive_web#gid=2

Hosting a mix to playtest the latest version:

tuesday @ 21 cest

http://imgur.com/a/ByMyR/layout/blog


Last edited by kKaltUu,

Pistolvania

Someone please stream this, seems really interesting

Selek

Dr. med.

This looks really good! I had my doubts after the first version’s screenshots, but this version might actually play well, with a more balanced third.

Quoted from Pistolvania

Someone please stream this, seems really interesting

I can if nobody else steps up

I’m a literal trashcan though

Spycy

TC.Express

Looks really cool :)

aura

Quoted from kKaltUu

Hosting a mix to playtest the latest version:

tuesday @ 21 cest

http://imgur.com/a/ByMyR/layout/blog

oh my god, why are you doing this? Can’t you just let it die. It has no future. Please for the love of god.


Last edited by aura,

Kresnik

Quoted from aura

[…]

oh my god, why are you doing this? Can’t you just let it die. It has no future. Please for the love of god.

The version being tested is one by a different mapmaker with some different changes. NA testing was very positive and I could easily see this overtaking stock badwater.

Meeto

Quoted from aura

[…]

oh my god, why are you doing this? Can’t you just let it die. It has no future. Please for the love of god.

I didn’t know Aura was the designated voice of the TF2 community.

Tseini

Damn!
0FO

nvm got scrim instead


Last edited by Tseini,

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