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An evaluation of tf2tv

Created 5th March 2011 @ 13:10

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the bm man

k^m

Well, it’s me again and before certain individuals start putting on their steel tipped boots, I ask you not to consider these arguments and analysis in terms of me writing them, but rather from a completely neutral perspective.

Before I dwell into what I believe to be wrong with TF2 casts in general, whilst using tf2tv as an example, I feel obliged to inform you that I hold no personal grudges against any of the casters or people who are involved in the site and production of their projects. I also appreciate the effort and time that goes into casting the games and making the vods.

However, the quality of these casts notably the coverage of EPIC.lan by tf2tv is simply not up to the standard that one would expect of a front running TF2 caster.

The main problem with the casting of any match by TF2tv is simply that they lack the most basic format for a commentary team in any sport. The format is a simple concept, one person does play by play and at least one other person (If a multi man team) is there to offer analysis and to spark discussion of notable events. This is true of every sport or e-sport in the world, from football to star craft this rings true. However the commentary of tf2tv is a very different affair. There is often no clear play by play caster, and more often than not it seems to be a constant switch between who is actually calling what, leading to people talking over each other and a wall of noise where it becomes difficult to distinguish who is actually saying what. This is a very basic issue that can easily be revolved, if you choose to cast a TF2 game or anything for that matter, decide a role you will play upon during the cast and stick to it.

The issue of observing is another example of a lack of structure to the commentary team. There were times when 2 of the casters were commenting on plays that were not actually witnessed by the observer which leads to a lack of appreciation of events that have transpired. Before you start crucifying me for this, I appreciate that tf2 is hardly the easiest game to cast, with 12 players it is infinitely more difficult to capture every moment of worth. However a solution to this problem, or at least making it less noticeable would be to have the main play by play caster be the observer as they are the one who should be primarily be casting anyways. Another solution to this would be to simply stream off of one person observing while the other casters are able to comment upon things that the audience can actually see, rather than simply imagining what is occurring. However this would be a difficult technical process, but still something for the casters to consider.

Another issue is the lack of analysis itself, with many times the casters would state events as they happened but not offer any reasoning behind it or why it was good/bad etc. An example would be times on gravel pit, where they would say “They have to get the soldier off the roof”, with no real reasoning behind it. You may state that this is an obvious thing and unless you’re a noob you should already understand. This however runs contrary to all of the recent strategies designed to get new people to play the game. A player from the highlander cup may stick around and see a cast, hearing all of this information about what player X is doing but without gaining any knowledge or reasoning behind the actions. It is one thing to simply witness something happening and to acknowledge it and it is another to actually give an explanation as to why it is happening.

During the finals of said tournament there were technical problems that were beyond the control of any of the casters, however their handling of this down time of no action is again not an effective method of casting. If the game is paused and you are waiting for it to resume, is it not better to talk about things that have happened before the pause, who is playing well, notable moments etc. This is a much more effective method of retaining the audience’s attention of keeping them interested in the game, as opposed to going off on some non-sensical tangent about pancakes or something just as irrelevant. Banter between casters is important and is a necessary part of casting, however it should always take a second place to analysis and keeping the audience involved in the game.

Another issue with the pauses, was the acknowledgement of one of the casters that they were in fact “Stalling for time”. Even if you are in fact stalling for time, you do not let the audience know that, it makes you seem more awkward, and if you are stalling for time their interest will fade. If you have ever seen a football game, when a player goes down injured and there is a lengthy period of time while they receive treatment, you never hear the commentators admit that they are stalling for time, this should be the same for tf2.

Now comes to the point I anticipate will draw the most controversy, and that is the lack of professionalism shown in the cast. There was a liberal use of “Fuck” and “Shit”, which is hardly a professionals response to casting a lan finals. You may come back with the counter point that this isn’t a serious cast and a lack of professionalism makes it more personal. I show no objections to this use of language during a mumble cast, or for the language in general, but went you are at a lan finals you are not only representing tf2 as a game for potential sponsors, and your organisation, but you are also representing the lan itself. Before you cast in this way ask yourself, “Is this language the organisers of the lan and the sponsors supporting it would want a cast to use while representing their event?”. And more often than not, the answer is no.

Another issue with the language used, is that even if you feel that “Joske’s voice annoys the shit out of you”, or you make reference to Payard’s former hacking ban, you do not mention it to the cast. First of all, it is your duty as a caster to put over the players and get people excited about the game, making personal comments about the players is not an effective way of doing this. I am also by no means saying that no matter what a player does they should be praised, but when it comes to comments on their personality it is not a professional thing to do. Now coming to making reference to past bans for hacking, quite frankly having 2 former hackers in a lan finals, and making reference to it, makes the game look like a joke to the outsiders

Now I’m sure many of you will disagree with me, purely because it is me writing the article, but please take the points as they are, because one day you’ll quit tf2, be disgusted at yourself for how much time and effort you put into it and think to yourself, wow, telebear was right after all.

P.s.
Saying why don’t you cast yourself???? Is not a reasonable reply to any point that I have made

nvc

I have a reasonable response for you: “QQ.”


Last edited by nvc,

Mark

Phase

Excellent article – everyone was thinking it, but no one had the balls to say anything.

the bm man

k^m

Quoted from nvc

I have a reasonable response for you: “QQ.”

glad it took you two times to write that

nvc

Quoted from the bm man

[…]

glad it took you two times to write that

“QQ.”

Menace

Would pay good money to see a telebear cast, would be jam-packed with enthusiasm and nail-biting tension.

ThePledge

Best post I’ve seen of you in like, forever.

Thanks for this, will take it into account for TF2TV as we’re evaluating casting quality pretty soon within the staff :) The only thing I don’t like is that, even though I asked on our website + on our irc channel, you don’t email me, but post it in public.

What’s your angle by publicly trying to attack us? Because even though I appreciate the feedback to my casting platform, the publicity seems like you’re out to get something.

– Pledge

Hosain H

Royal`

Man this guy sure likes to complain

the bm man

k^m

by posting in publically it creates debate and brings public attention to issues i’ve put forward, people will also be more inclined to give feedback in a public setting

WildCard

Very nice read, I agree with nearly everything you have stated.

Hopefully the current casters throughout TF2 will read and take notice of the points you raised.

nvc

Quoted from the bm man

by posting in publically it creates debate and brings public attention to issues i’ve put forward, people will also be more inclined to give feedback in a public setting

Yea i agree; I mean “TF2 is slow and boring full of QQ baby noobs” – how can you possibly give advice on a game you think is boring to watch anyway? :)


Last edited by nvc,

Skyride

DUCS

I actually gave this the benefit of the doubt and read the whole thing, and tbh you’re not too far wrong. A few things are bang on correct and another few things aren’t possible due to practical/logistical reasons.

Professionalism: You mention this from the Epic.LAN final, I agree with you about the swearing. However the main casters were ShoX and David given they were at the event. ShoX is not usually even a caster for TF2TV and it’s just how he talks, so fair play to him really.

Observer: Every game that is streamed by TF2TV, is done so by Comedian. This is simply because he is the only person with an internet connection capable of streaming in HD, it’s genuinely that simple. But I do see where you’re coming from.

Casting Style: I tend to agree with you on that. Everyone seems to be a play-by-play caster, they could really do with some proper casting duos. I’m in the tf2tv staff IRC channel, and “hey, who’s up for casting ‘x'” is quite a common thing said. It’s just because there isn’t really enough organisation.

On the other hand, I don’t really understand your motivations for posting this publically. Pledge has already said on multiple occassions he’s happy to listen to people’s criticisms on IRC or whatever.


Last edited by Skyride,

the bm man

k^m

yep thats exactly what i said in this particular article thanks nvc

the bm man

k^m

Quoted from nvc

[…]

how can you possibly give advice on a game you think is boring to watch anyway? :)

im talking about the quality of the casting not the quality of the game itself

nvc

Anyway, aside from the writer being an absolute spastic 99% of the time, some valid points made. Hopefully TF2TV will take some of it into account and keep up the good work.

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