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Need people good at maths !

Created 5th November 2013 @ 15:06

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knuck

DA!

So what should I do then ? I understood everyobody’s point, but what should I do to find the average unemployment rate in Europe ? Add all the total population of the European Union and divide it by the total population of unemployed people in Europe ?

Bungle

use basic example

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weighted_arithmetic_mean

ie:

germany % * germany’s population + france % * france’s population + …

divided by

germany’s population + france’s population + …


Last edited by Bungle,

Falcon0408

Quoted from knuck

So what should I do then ? I understood everyobody’s point, but what should I do to find the average unemployment rate in Europe ? Add all the total population of the European Union and divide it by the total population of unemployed people in Europe ?

Average unemployment rate in Europe is a useless statistic and won’t tell you anything (partly because of shitters like Greece and Spain dicking on the percentages, partly because the following is way more useful). What you probably want is the Total unemployment rate, which is just 100*[total unemployed]/[total population]


Last edited by Falcon0408,

Permzilla

(Legend)
(☞゚ヮ゚)☞
WiK?

Quoted from knuck

So what should I do then ? I understood everyobody’s point, but what should I do to find the average unemployment rate in Europe ? Add all the total population of the European Union and divide it by the total population of unemployed people in Europe ?

Yup. Quite a bit of work I’d imagine, surely this statistic is already found somewhere?

feeling

ist doof

Sorry but you don’t understand what unemployment rate actually expresses. It reflects the ratio of unemployed people to the labor force. Total labor force is part of the unemployment rate, so there’s no reason to weigh according to labor force! Population doesn’t have anything to do with it. Also, you can’t take total labor force into account because this would suggest that Germany has more unemployed people than Slovakia. Considering the size of the labor force, Germany doesn’t though. That’s what unemployment rate is about. If you took the absolute size of the labor force into account when calculating an average unemployment rate, this would skew the result in favor of bigger countries. That is not the point of it. You want to find out what the average ratio of unemployed people to the labor force is.


Last edited by feeling,

Starkie

ulti?
sniper

Quoted from feeling

Sorry but you don’t understand what unemployment rate actually expresses. It reflects the ratio of unemployed people to the labor force. Total labor force is part of the unemployment rate, so there’s no reason to weigh according to work force! Population doesn’t have anything to do with it. Also, you can’t take total work force into account because this would suggest that Germany has more unemployed people than Slovakia. Considering the size of the work force, Germany doesn’t though. That’s what unemployment rate is about. If you took the absolute size of the work force into account when calculating an average unemployment rate, this would skew the result in favor of bigger countries. That is not the point of it. You want to find out what the average ratio of unemployed to the labor force is.

let’s say germany has 0% unemployment and 10 million people but I decide to create my own country with just me living in it, and I dont work
therefore the average unemployment rate in germany and my country is 50%
this is what you get when you dont consider the population (population meaning the total number of people capable of working)

feeling

ist doof

Quoted from Starkie

[…]
let’s say germany has 0% unemployment and 10 million people but I decide to create my own country with just me living in it, and I dont work
therefore the average unemployment rate in germany and my country is 50%
this is what you get when you dont consider the population (population meaning the total number of people capable of working)

Entirely hypothetical and thus useless argument. You have to understand that what I explained is not a mathematical rebuttal. Of course you could calculate a weighted average but it doesn’t make sense on any level.


Last edited by feeling,

Starkie

ulti?
sniper

Quoted from feeling

[…]
Hypothetical argument.

its your logic taken to an extreme

Starkie

ulti?
sniper

using fancy words doesnt make your point right

Starkie

ulti?
sniper

(also they make you look quite the sillybilly)


Last edited by Starkie,

Trath

Quoted from Permzilla

He is confused (I think) because each country has a different population and therefore a different weight towards the total average of Europe, which none of you have taken into consideration.

For example if Germany averages 5.2% and Slovakia Republic 14%, the true average for both countries combined is not 9.6% because Germany has a much bigger weight towards it. This is my opinion anyway, not sure if it’s right.

Which is why I explained it to him clearly.

rge

Quoted from knuck

So what should I do then ? I understood everyobody’s point, but what should I do to find the average unemployment rate in Europe ? Add all the total population of the European Union and divide it by the total population of unemployed people in Europe ?

I would say that really depends on for what your statistic is meant to be and what it should express.

If you want to show the number/percentage of unemployed people all over Europe, you should go with a weighted arithmetic mean.

If you want to show the situation more on a country basis I would simply add up the percentage values divided by the number of countries.

For Example:

If we have 10 fictional countries, 9 with a unemployment rate of 90% and 1 with 5%.
The 1 has 10.000 people and the other 9 only 10.

weighted: 10.000 + (9*10) / (9*9 + 500) ~ 0,58 = 5,8 %

not weighted: ((90% * 9) + 5%) / 10 = 81,5%

Most of the countries have a very high unempl. rate, disregarded the low population.
So IMHO the second number would reflect the situation better for a “country-based” overview.

If seperate countries don’t matter, only the total number of people. I would go for the first one.
But an arithmetic mean is only a small part of statistics. There might be much more appropriate methods to express your numbers.

Hope this makes sense :E


Last edited by rge,

feeling

ist doof

Quoted from Starkie

using fancy words doesnt make your point right
(also they make you look quite the sillybilly)

Online behavior when you realised you’re wrong or don’t have any valid arguments :)


Last edited by feeling,

Starkie

ulti?
sniper

Quoted from feeling

Online behavior when you know you’re wrong or don’t have any valid arguments :)

heh
also i clearly used the word sillybilly

Permzilla

(Legend)
(☞゚ヮ゚)☞
WiK?

Quoted from Starkie

[…]
heh
also i clearly used the word sillybilly

admins r froglovers

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